11-08-2011, 07:58 AM
I noticed the Super Skipjack does not have a daggerboard and the old one does. Is the daggerboard needed in the old plans. We are thinking about building one of the older skipjacks. Thanks Susan
11-08-2011, 07:58 AM
11-08-2011, 08:30 AM
The original Weekender had a daggerboard also. But the Stevenson's (and everybody else!) realized the boat could sail perfectly well without it. There is therefore more room in the cockpit/cabin now that it has been eliminated. The Super Skipjack is just a slightly scaled down Weekender, and should sail well without the need for a centerboard.
Dave
Dave
11-08-2011, 11:48 AM
I currently have the plans from a book for the original skipjack and was looking at making the inside roomier and adding some seating for my mother. I was thinking if the daggerboard is not needed I would just get rid of it.
Susan
Susan
11-08-2011, 12:04 PM
I think you can do without the daggerboard.
11-08-2011, 04:50 PM
Without the daggerboard you will lose a significant amount of windward ability and maneuvering crispness. So, if you don't mind excessive leeward skid and slow helm response, then skip the daggerboard. Simply put, with exception to these Stevenson designs, you will find no other shoal draft craft, of similar size and configuration that doesn't have some sort of appendage, typically lee/center/daggerboard arrangements or shoal fins and bilge boards or runners.
If you place the dagger well off center, you can gain some usable interior space. This was a Phil Bolger tactic, that works fairly well, though does favor one tack over another. Another common technique is bilge boards and leeboards. Leeboards are just as effective as daggers and centerboards, but leave the interior completely unmolested, though do clutter up the exterior a bit. Lastly, and a technique I use on many of my smaller designs is to house the centerboard completely in a keel stub. This gets the case out from under foot and still offers the lateral area and pivot point necessary for reasonable windward ability and something the boat can pivot on in turns.
If you place the dagger well off center, you can gain some usable interior space. This was a Phil Bolger tactic, that works fairly well, though does favor one tack over another. Another common technique is bilge boards and leeboards. Leeboards are just as effective as daggers and centerboards, but leave the interior completely unmolested, though do clutter up the exterior a bit. Lastly, and a technique I use on many of my smaller designs is to house the centerboard completely in a keel stub. This gets the case out from under foot and still offers the lateral area and pivot point necessary for reasonable windward ability and something the boat can pivot on in turns.
11-08-2011, 05:05 PM
How does the super skipjack handle this issue with slippage.
11-09-2011, 03:38 PM
Leeward skid is just a fact of life when you lack sufficient lateral area. All shoal draft vessels with their appendages retracted or ones that haven't large enough appendages, will skid off to leeward. The amount is dependent on the resistance provided, by a small degree from the hull, but to a large degree by the appendages, be they a keel, fin or retractable board.
The old school way of handling this was a big hunk of deadwood, below the hull proper, which was like trying to push a tool shed sideways through the water. This was effective, but also heavy and not especially shoal. In the mid 18th century the centerboard, leeboards and daggerboards were "re-invented" by American ship builders. The concept was hijacked from northern European lowland country's shallow water craft. Areas of the east coast needed shallow draft and adaptations where made.
This eliminated the need for a big deadwood assembly, lightening the boats considerably and improving maneuverability too. Continuous development since has this form of appendage arrangement, the hands down favorite among designs of all types. Many refinements to hoisting options, board locations, sectional and plan form shapes, etc. have made, making most well designed shoal craft, nearly equal in most regards to fix appendage vessels.
As to your question about the SkipJack, I suspect it'll be much like the Weekender and skid off to leeward at a considerable rate. How much, well at least several degrees, which is substantial. My latest centerboard design 15' 6" boat has a 3 to 4 degree lose to leeward when close hauled. Even a fixed fin keel boat will skid some to leeward, but several degrees, possibly double digit loses to leeward, aren't acceptable to most experienced skippers.
All this said, builders of these boats generally aren't as interested in the "preformance envelop" as much as style, comfort and relaxed sailing. To this, so what if you skid off 12 degrees, you just make an extra tack or two and all is well. As a cruiser, puttering around lakes, rivers and estuaries, some lose to leeward isn't a very big deal. So, in the end you can decide if you want or even need a board. Most don't even notice the issue until they're trying to keep pace with other types of boats, that do have retractable appendages. Even in this situation you still can just make a few extra tacks, maybe foot off a touch to make better speed and make up the lost ground. It all depends on what type of skipper you are. If you're new to sailing, as many of these builders are, then you'll never know what you're missing, so why bother.
The old school way of handling this was a big hunk of deadwood, below the hull proper, which was like trying to push a tool shed sideways through the water. This was effective, but also heavy and not especially shoal. In the mid 18th century the centerboard, leeboards and daggerboards were "re-invented" by American ship builders. The concept was hijacked from northern European lowland country's shallow water craft. Areas of the east coast needed shallow draft and adaptations where made.
This eliminated the need for a big deadwood assembly, lightening the boats considerably and improving maneuverability too. Continuous development since has this form of appendage arrangement, the hands down favorite among designs of all types. Many refinements to hoisting options, board locations, sectional and plan form shapes, etc. have made, making most well designed shoal craft, nearly equal in most regards to fix appendage vessels.
As to your question about the SkipJack, I suspect it'll be much like the Weekender and skid off to leeward at a considerable rate. How much, well at least several degrees, which is substantial. My latest centerboard design 15' 6" boat has a 3 to 4 degree lose to leeward when close hauled. Even a fixed fin keel boat will skid some to leeward, but several degrees, possibly double digit loses to leeward, aren't acceptable to most experienced skippers.
All this said, builders of these boats generally aren't as interested in the "preformance envelop" as much as style, comfort and relaxed sailing. To this, so what if you skid off 12 degrees, you just make an extra tack or two and all is well. As a cruiser, puttering around lakes, rivers and estuaries, some lose to leeward isn't a very big deal. So, in the end you can decide if you want or even need a board. Most don't even notice the issue until they're trying to keep pace with other types of boats, that do have retractable appendages. Even in this situation you still can just make a few extra tacks, maybe foot off a touch to make better speed and make up the lost ground. It all depends on what type of skipper you are. If you're new to sailing, as many of these builders are, then you'll never know what you're missing, so why bother.
11-09-2011, 07:25 PM
Thanks for all the great information. I guess I will wait and make final decision while building. I really like the size of this boat but I need somewhere for my mom to sit in the boat. I really appreciate you taking the time to answer the questions. I will not be racing other boats just cruising sedately on our lake.
Susan
Susan
11-09-2011, 11:59 PM
Years ago my dad and i built the 12 ft skipjack with the daggerboard i found we had loads of room for 2
11-10-2011, 04:05 AM
Paul says it very well above. I am experienced and do sail in company with other boats fairly often. I will be building a board of some kind on my weekender this coming spring, just haven't decided if it will be a dagger or centreboard. It is really quite impressive what a few degrees more slippage will do over a days sailing when you are trying to keep a few boats together. It can also make a difference if the weather turns bad and you need to get back to port. But again, it sails well without the board if you don't care that much. Hope this helps Susan.