BYYB Forums

So I went to Lowes and Home Depot looking for screws. First I found some 1 1/2" zinc coated stainless steel screws. I went back home looked at my plan packet and found an update paper talking about sintered drywall/decking screws. Have no idea what that is. I found some exterior screws with rustoleum. Supposed to never rust. Also the update says use 1 3/8" screws. They have 1 1/4" and 1 5/8". I was hoping to get the keel done tomorrow. Thamks for any help.
Susan

Screws come in as many types as the men you've probably discounted as NPWIH (no possible way in hell) types for your next date.

Generally, there are three types, mild steel, stainless and bronze. There are others, like aluminum, brass, plastic, etc. but these three are the basic choices. Of the mild steel only two types work moderately well in the marine environment and they are zinc coated and galvanized. Of these, only one works really well and that's hot dipped galvanized. These are easy to identify, because they galvanizing is coated roughly and the fasteners look coated with a thick silver goo. Zinc plated and the other forms of mild steel coating just don't hold up long.

Next on the list and what most use is stainless steel. Take a magnet to the hardware store with you and run it over the bin with stainless screws in it. If they are attracted, it's crappy stainless and should be avoided. Most Ace Hardware stores carry a moderately good grade of 304 stainless. A really good rare earth magnet will attract these screws, but a regular common magnet will not. This is what you want, a stainless screw that doesn't stick to a regular magnet. Of course you can order better grades, like 316 or 316L stainless, but they cost more and considering the project, maybe not worth the bother, unless you plan on lot of salt water sailing.

Bronze is the screw I use almost exclusively, but I'm a pro and need the durability. Bronze is the bee's knees and the prices reflect how good a fastener material it is (it ain't cheap). You don't need bronze.

Lastly are the specialty fasteners, like bugle head drywall, special coatings, etc. Don't bother with these as project fasteners, they truly suck. Now, drywall screws can be used as temporary fasteners to hold things as the goo cures. The coarse thread drywall screws are the best in wood. They aren't very strong and you can easily break off the head, leaving the threaded shank still in the wood (that'll piss you off), but they are self tapping for the most part and strong enough for most setup. I use them (and re-use them) by the pound.

Depending on where you live you might have a "Fasten All" near you. They have or can get good screws. You can also get them on line too. McFeelys.com is another place and they have square drive, which is far better then other types (Phillips, slotted, etc.).

I would recommend a cordless impact screwdriver to anyone starting one of these projects .  

Great information on the screws. I went to Ace Hardware also. They did not have any screws in 1 1/2' size. My mom keeps reminding me to get this boat right because she can't swim.
Susan

One word of caution with screws and these plans.  I've found that the recommended screw sizes are often just a tad too long and can poke through after you've drilled your counter-sink hole.

Also, if you can get them there, I recommend what we Canadians call Robertson screws - the square drive ones - and yes, a cordless screwdriver of some sort with lots of battery power separate from the tool you'll use to counter-sink will save you a lot of aggravation and your wrists.

Paul and I usually have arguments around material quality - he's a big believer in using the best product for a job where I often go for the one that I can afford that does the job.  I have a number of projects that I've assembled using standard galvanized screws that have lasted in my (not marine) conditions for many many years.  If however you are expecting to keep your boat in a slip or are sailing in salt water the better fasteners may well be a good idea.

I take my Dremal Tool with a drum sander and just touch the tip of the srcew after a section is assembled. 

      Alan

Greetings Susan,

I bought my stainless screws from Jamestown Distributors.

http://www.jamestowndistributors.com


http://www.jamestowndistributors.com/use...+Screws+FP

They are the 18-8 (304) alloy that Paul recommends, and the shank an head together are about the same size as the thickness of the plywood sheets you are using, which is ideal for fastening plywood as you want all of the threads to be contained in the piece you are fastening the plywood to. They still cost a little less than $10 per box of 100, but they were better than anything I could find at the local hardware stores. I also bought a matching adjustable-depth counter sink set so that I could accurately drill the holes required by the screws.

Cheers,
Tom

I had a hard time finding screws also. I was using s.s. deck screws until I dropped by the local Fastenal store.  They have s.s. sheet metal screws plus s.s. bolts, nuts, and washers. Their prices are very reasonable and if they don't have exactly what you need they can get it quickly.

    I don't understand why Stainless Screws, eboxy for gluing and marine plywood has to be used if we're covering everything with fiberglass anyway.  The sailboats we're building are Trailer Sailers, in the water for a few minutes until "Our Ass" is in it and a few minutes after "Our Ass" is out, if left at The Dock unattended all season no matter how well built any Sailboat or any other would probably "SINK".
      Why play with all The Toxic and Harmfull Stuff until we have to?

      Alan

I'm not sure of your experience Alan, but epoxy isn't all that toxic and stainless is necessary because the Stevenson designs aren't encapsulated.

In a perfect world, you'd be right and we wouldn't need fasteners of any kind. In fact, I have several designs that ultimately have no fasteners other then screws to hold hardware to the deck. The hull shell, cabin, decks, etc. all are glued down and temporary fasteners removed. The reality is the Stevenson designs, are not engineered in this fashion and require fasteners. Since epoxy is used haphazardly and in most cases quite sparingly, the moisture vapor in the marine environment will get at what ever fasteners you use. If the fastener is buried in wood and the moisture content goes up past a certain point, the fastener will start to break down. Mild steel first, followed by galvanized, followed by stainless. Bronze fasteners are the most "noble" and will stand longer then anything, but it's price places in the fine yacht category. You can use mild steel fasteners if you like, but you fairly quickly see brownish, red stains appearing at each fastener location. This tends to piss you off, especially right after a fresh paint job.

As far as epoxy goes, it not wise to bath in it, nor rub it in your eyes or eat it, in spite of it's good taste on toast (usually needs a little salt). Once it's cured, it's inert. In fact, the wires and circuit boards, used when they implant electronics in humans, are coated with epoxy to prevent shorts and more importantly to resist the extremely moist environment inside a person. That's pretty inert stuff. This said, uncured goo is mildly toxic, but it takes a fairly large amount of "accumulation" in the body. This is why standard precautions are used, such as dust masts when sanding, gloves when applying, etc. If you employ the usual safety procedures, you'll have a very low "exposure" rate and likely little harm. The vast majority of folks that have difficulty haven't used solid safety procedures and/or have allergies to alkaline substances.

In fact, the polyester resin system recommended in the plans, is much more harmful to you then epoxy. All you have to do is open a can of this stuff and one whiff tells you all you need to know.