BYYB Forums

There has been some discussion about sea worthiness and boats in unprotected waters.  It really comes down to opinions and abilities most of the time but this video and others like it demostrate to me what open/unprotected water and sea worthiness mean: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eiRgKXs92...L&index=23
I don't know how the guy ended up in the spot he was but the boat he was sailing didn't sink.  To me sea worthiness means coming back from a knockdown like that boat took without sinking.  If the bay or waters I was sailing could unexpectedly experience waves even 8-10 I would want a boat with that kind of sea worthiness.

Years ago I use to sail in Hawaii.  One of the older salts there use to say he wouldn't go past the breakwater in any boat that couldn't recover from a horizontal knock down or pop back up from being submerged 14 feet or so.  I never saw him leave shore but was told repeatedly "the old guy knows what he's talkin bout" by most that knew him.  The waters around Hawaii can unexpectedly experience 8-10 foot waves, rip tides and undertows.

On an entirely different note and totally off topic, unless a wooden boat outsailing a plastic is the topic, here is the video of a Folkboat catching and passing a Bluebird25.  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gpTVoE4FWgM

Surf that size would smash our little boats into matchwood.  :o

Judgment calls are important. When to reef? What to drop sails and motor? I've been caught in some nasty waves and weather, was in 6-8 foot waves on Great Slave Lake several times. Not pleasant conditions, however my son and I were able to motor to sheltered water. The Vacationer can take this kind of weather, and get you home. I wouldn't recommend seeking it out on a regular basis.

After having been stuck in a bay for 2 days several years ago waiting for gale conditions to subside on one journey. I carry an emergency ration package, with a week's food.

I also use a SPOT to keep family, in the loop, and get assistance if required, from select friends. I'm equipped with a VHF radio that has good range with the repeater sites around the lake, It gives me current weather, and access to Coast Guard radio.

The more precautions you take, the better your odds if nature gets ugly.

Greg

Greg:  Great Slave Lake is a freakin" ocean compared to our local lakes.  We do have Lake Michigan nearby (about 10 miles).  My plan is to be fully conversant with my Weekender in a smaller pond, and then expand my range as appropriate.  I may build a Vacationer if I plan to spent more time on the Great Lake.

Dave

Like pilot error, for those that fly, a lot of getting in trouble is judgement and skills (ending up IFR when not rated or geared for it comes to mind).  My point on Sea Worthiness wasn't avoiding the situation the guy was in or being smart enough to not be there at all.  It was whether a boat could take the knockdown and pounding from waves and not capsize.  I have to go with Andrew on this one.  The boat in the video was plastic but there are many wooden boats that can handle the same adversity.  Wooden boats built for open or unprotected water usually have 2x4 strength or better construction in them and not 1x1 stringers.  They also have water tight cabins, self draining cockpits, ballast, the ability to right themselves from a 90 degree knockdown and life lines.

It really comes down to opinions though.  Some would say a boat is sea worthy if it gets you out and back.  I know there are days or places many of you would sail that I would pass on.  Call me conservative.  I don't consider myself an accomplished sailer at this time (to many years ago for the experiences I had and not enough of those experiences, but I'd like to work on it).  However for me to venture out into areas where the waves can get 20 feet and crest or even 10-12 and crest I would want a boat that could survive a knockdown and pop back up with it's hull in tack and only minor water below.

Most of my sailing took place in Hawaii off the Island of Oahu.  The waves there can be huge and 20 foot in areas is not uncommon.  We use to sail from the western shore to the northern shore around Kaena Point.  The waves off Kaena, on a calm day, are 20 foot.  The current is 8+ knots straight out to see (next stop Japan, 6000 miles away, unless you miss or sink.)  The waves on the north shore can be enourmous.  At Waimea Bay they close the coast road at times, during the winter storms, and that road is 300 yards inland and 60+ feet above the water level.  Certainly no one sails then and there but even on calm days waves that are a consistent 6-8 can experience intermitent 20+ waves due to seismic activity.

I am not trying to run down any of Stevenson's designs.  I have built one and considered building a second.  I owned 3 sets of plans (Triad, Skipjack and Weekender).  I am just painting the details on the Triad, still have the Skipjack plans and gave the Weekender plans to a forum member knowing I wanted a bit larger boat if I was to have one with a cabin.  I was just pointing out what I would want in a boat that might end up facing unsheltered conditions on water large enough to blow up on me.  Well I also wanted to share that video and the race between the two boats since I was enjoying several sailing videos on youtube.

Terry,

Sailing in Hawaii is serious stuff; we took one of our Weekenders out of Hanalei (N.Shore of Kauai) on a fast but steady, low-chop day. Fun, but it required a LOT of concentration. A couple years later we took our catamaran Valkyrie out on a day after a Kona storm had come through. We left Nawiliwili and hit crazy reflected wave patterns from the straight cliffs nearby. Really wild! Water way over the boat one second and then a gaping hole right next to the boat in a few more seconds! Very weird.

The Triad prototype was also done on Kauai, but it was sailed inside the reef all the time.

Yep: I wouldn't want to find anything even a tenth of what that video showed while in one of our boats. I don't feel like using up all my luck in one go!

Mike

Mike,

I miss Hawaii.  The constant light warm breezes.  The clear blue skies.  The crystal clear water.  The shave ice with ice cream in the bottom.  A plate of teriyaki beef with a scoop of rice ($2.50 when I was there and so good after some surf fun or a dive).  The high would be 84 and the low 72.  You could live in a tee shirt and shorts or swim trunks with some dive tobis for foot wear.  We use to keep a couple tanks of air, a mask, snorkle, fins and regulator in our car (we would put 2-3 pounds of weight on the tank strap or in our pockets to get neutral boyancy) so we could dive at a moments notice.  I logged over 300 dives while there.  I collected sea shells back then (now days if I dive I take nothing but times were different) and may have one of the largest Hawaiian shell collections anywhere.

I mostly sailed on large cats back then.  Usually I was a guest but sometimes was allowed to tend a line.  I think I even got to hold course once or twice (seriously only once or twice the Cap was very cautious about the boats position).  Of course there were many calm days where the only concern was if the guests had enough to drink.  Back then there would be 3 or 4 forty foot or larger cats off Waikiki with a crew member walking along the beach asking tourists if they wanted to ride on a sailboat.  These would be run by locals so it is not easy to get on a crew or even get a ride unless you paid (even in the 70's there was a lot of tension between the locals and us haole).  I got in with them by supplying lobsters and Coors beer on occasion.  This was in the early 70's and you could only get Coors in California or Colorado.  When I came back from prisoner drops at Levenworth (I was Military Police 25th Inf. Div. and any of US soldiers that got sentenced to Levenworth from the Pacific area were handled by the 25th Infantry Division.)  I would pick up a case or two of Coors on the way home.  Add 10 pounds of lobster tails and you would be suprised how friendly the locals got.

There's a spot on the north shore of Oahu called Sharks Cove.  Thats a local name so don't check for it on maps.  They used the area for check out dives in the day time because lava flows form an area protected from the waves for divers to gear up without being knocked about.  Out past the protection of the lava flows the waves are easily 8 foot or higher at night.  Unless you like bleeding from being bashed on jagged lava it is no place to be.  A buddy and I found a lava tunnel, about 50 yards long that let out in 30 foot water.  Still some motion down at that depth but not enough so you can't control yourself.  The prize was at night the place was alive with lobsters.  It was easy for each diver to get 10 pounds of tails on a 40 minyte dive there.

If we (my dive partners and some other comrades from my company) were doing it for ourselves we would fire up some hibachi grills, barbaque the lobster tails, cook some hash browns and wash it all down with Coors beer.  There use to be a commercial years ago where friends got together and the last line of the commercial was "it doesn't get any better then this"  well those nights on the lava flows with friends, usually one had a guitar so some music, the bug tails and beer were moments that don't get any better.

It never ceases to amaze me how popular Coors beer is. I wonder what the locals in Hawaii would do for a bottle of nice, brown, Canadian beer.

Big Rock Traditional AAAhhh Yes

Greg

Ya hey there,

Canadian beer is evil ... EVIL, I tell you.

Here's the proof ...


http://www.greatlakesbeer.com/brands.html

;D
Cheers,
Tom