BYYB Forums

Hi everyone-

I'm looking for a little help with tacking my weekender.  I have had some limited success getting the boat to tack but it does not seem to do it as well as I would like and I cant seem to figure out why.  Some background is that I have two batteries near the bow of the boat, one for the trolling motor and one for lights and they probably make up about 50 lbs or more combined.  My sails are relatively worn poly tarp, yet they will make the boat move pretty well so I think they look worse than they really are.  My rudder seems pretty effective so I dont think that is the problem.  Last weekend I took the boat out alone in 18kt wind with some pretty large white capping waves (probably not the smartest idea to begin with) but I put in the second reef and decided to simply take the jib completely off to depower the boat and reduce the likelyhood of going turtle.  The boat would point relatively well, but even when I would gather up as much speed as possible which was likely a good 3-4 kts, when I would attempt to tack into the wind the boat would just point directly into the wind and sit there as it seemed all my momentum was lost by the time I made it to this point.  My technique was to not point too high to maintain speed and to sheet in a little as I started to make the turn so I could catch the wind on the opposite tack as quickly as possible.  At this point the main was just luffing and within seconds the boat would start to move backwards against the rudder so I would center it, gain some power on the tack I had just been on and repeat until I was forced to jibe due to the on coming shore.  My thoughts are that I'm either turning too sharp too fast and the rudder is acting like a brake in conjunction with turning the boat or that the wind was just strong enough to kill all the inertia my light little boat with only me in it has.  Another thought is that the jib helps quite a bit with the ability to tack and not lose momentum as you point or that the reefed main made a difference as well in not being able to pick the wind back up as I turned into the wind.

The times I have had the best yet still limited ability to tack has been in wind of about 10kts with two other people on board along with a working jib. 

I'd appreciate any thoughts as I'm pretty frustrated and would really like to make the boat work to my pretty reasonable expectations.  One last question I have is if my worn sails would have any impact on my ability to point into the wind as the boat does not seem to perform well at all in this area although I am able to make limited progress into the wind. 

Thanks

If you're having trouble tacking (something I don't remember ever having problems with, -but maybe I just have been doing it so long that it just comes naturally), -here are the things to do to help her tack: 1. Let her heel well through the turn. Chine-steering does a lot to turn the boat when it's heeled well. 2. Like you say, let her fall off to build a little extra speed. 3. Pull in on the main to help her heel, while letting out on the jib so it doesn't hold the bow from coming through the wind. 4. When you're through the wind, loose the main and pull in on the jib to pull the bow through all the way.
I'm a bit puzzled by your boat's reluctance to tack. It's something we haven't had a lot of complaints about. Try this routine and see if she doesn't perform better.

Thanks for the help.  Its getting cold here in Omaha so I may not get the chance until the spring but I'll copy this and see what I can do.  Any other suggestions out there?

It won't tack well without the jib. I too tried sailing with the main only, and didn't like it very much. Having lots of weight in the bows may not help much either. With the centre of mass forward and all that sail aft, your boat may be too fond of pointing into the wind to want to fall off again. With no jib, there's nothing to pull her down onto the opposite tack once the bow passes through the wind. Her tendency to weathercock will work against you, with speed falling off, trying to force her onto the opposite tack. Without enough rudder authority to keep her head down, she's happier to rotate back into the wind than to gather speed on the new tack.

Interesting note,  I really felt that this was part of the problem but just couldnt really figure out why.  The more I think about it the more I think that I was pushing the tiller over a little too fast and sheeting in more than I should have instead of just letting the boom swing over with a little bit of slack left in it.  All my previous sailing is on a bermuda rig and the gaff rig seems to always want to be sheeted out more which is taking some getting used to.  I think the key will be to sail in better conditions with better sails, carry more speed into the tack, make a less aggessive turn, use the jib, and leave the main sheeted out as I'm tacking.  After watching the building video again and seeing how they are tacking I think this is more of what they are doing and what I need to do.  One other thing I think was my biggest problem is that I am really not moving as fast as I would like to think and in a stiff head wind of nearly 20kts and gusts higher I need some serious momentum to make it through the tack.  I think I need to tack from close to a beam reach to see best results.  Is this what everyone else does?

Yes. I've noticed that the higher the wind speed, the more difficult it is to keep the speed up while passing through the wind's eye. Proper handling of the jib is key. The boat really loses speed due to the head wind when the wind is strong. It's a pretty light boat, without much inertia. Reefing the main and using the jib properly make the boat better behaved in strong wind. Also, I deleted the club on my jib and rigged it with two sheets, in the common fashion. This increases the control I have over the jib and allows for backing the jib when necessary, this allows greater boat control with the jib.

I have also eliminated the club foot for the jib based on the performance I saw with it and due to yours and others comments about just using the standard two sheet rigging for the jib.  With the high winds last weekend I felt that it would be no issue to remove the jib for less power (more control) and have two less sheets to worry about should things get really harry.  Things did get really harry a couple times (main sheet getting hung up and some serious heel) so I like to think I made the right decision, but it seems the best thing to do may be to make a smaller storm jib so that I can still run a jib without the worry during high winds.  I am also starting to think I have too much weight up in the bow so I'm planning to move my battery for lights and power to a more central area in the boat such as where the tool box/seat is at the companion way and leave my trolling battery in the bow.  As light as the boat is it seems that balance of weight even if its 100lbs can make a significant difference in how it sits in the water which affects its turning, tacking and weather helm characteristics.  Thanks for the comments, more ideas and help are always welcome

Lee

Lee if you throw over (reverse) your helm when in irons you can let the wind back you into the tack.  Once she is pointed where you want to go bring up the helm snug the sheets and off you go!  A man on a fast dolphin will never see you do it !! 

Craig I had actually thought of doing just that, essentially back winding the jib to carry the nose over into the next tack if necessary.  For everyone, I was actually able to go sailing this past Sunday and had a very successful day.  Wind was blowing close to 15 mph so I left the main at the second reef point where it already was and raised the jib as well.  I also moved one of my batteries next to the tool box in the companion way so that it neither made the bow lower or the stern lower.  I must say that I feel the jib made a huge difference in the way the boat tacks.  Essentially I used all the suggestions mentioned above and never really missed a tack.  The boat simply requires a lot more speed to complete a tack when the wind is blowing pretty good and this is something that is just new to me as I did all my sailing lessons on a catalina 22 that had more ballast wt in its wing keel than my boat weighs all together.  I'm starting to get used to the feel of this boat heeling as well as how it likes to tack and how it handles as a really light boat compared to the catalina.  'I feel the three greatest things I gained was to carry more speed into a tack, use the jib even if its pretty windy since it helps bring the bow of the boat around and really doesnt seem to contribute much to the heel of the boat, and to not have the boat be so bow heavy as it seemed to make the boat weather helm considerably worse. 

Thanks or all the suggestions and help it was much appreciated and worked great

Lee

Glad to hear it. I remember someone here explaining once that a boat that is deigned to sail with a foresail will not sail particularly well without one.